Quote: Bomber @ April 1 2008, 1:39 AM BST

Some production companies have a habit of doing that - i.e. sending a script off to the channels without buying an option on it first. It's not really the way it should be done (after all, if it's good enough to be sent off with their name attached, it should be worth *something*, right?). For the writer, though, it's a question of balance - particularly when it's one of your first irons in the comedy fire. You want it to be seen by the Beeb (or whoever), but you also want some dosh for it. Do you tell them they can't send it without optioning it first, and risk them passing on it altogether? Well, the answer ought to be "yes", but it's not always that simple when you're in the situation. In practice these days, my writing partner and I tend to hold firm for an option, but annoyingly we do have a few things kicking around from the past couple of years that have been seen by the channels without us getting a bean for them. And once the channels have seen them and passed on them (if they do, that is!), they're suddenly not worth much. Hey ho... hold out for an option - that's what I say.

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But a script is only worth something if a channel is interested.

At the end of the day, whomever should be happy their script has been fast tracked to the big wigs at the BBC via a big company, rather than letting it rot in the writer's room not getting read.

An indie can't just dish out 5 grand, unless they know it's got a chance of getting made.

 

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If they have faith in it they will put their money where their mouth is. It's about mutual commitment, not money.



Mind you money is nice.
 

Quote: Marc P @ April 1 2008, 1:40 PM BST

If they have faith in it they will put their money where their mouth is. It's about mutual commitment, not money.



Mind you money is nice.

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No that's not how it works at all.

Early in your career you should be grateful these people are even giving you the time of day, let alone helping you with your work.
 

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What people??
 

Quote: Marc P @ April 1 2008, 2:28 PM BST

What people??

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People in a general term I mean.

Any uncommissioned, unrepresented writer should feel honoured that people in the industry are taking an interest and are giving them chance to take their careers forward.

Not many do.

So going 'Can I have some payment now please' really should be the last thing on anyone's mind.

Though having read your post again, it's a bit confusing so therefore this looks confusing too.

 

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I'm not saying I disagree with your sentiment. I do think 'feeling honoured' is perhaps a tad too far. It's about a two way investment, and a fee for an option is basically taking the project off the market. That's what it is there for. Doesn't have to be about money of course, but there is usually a certain amount of development that takes place after an option so it's all tied up with that as well. As the title of your thread suggests, maybe this is the sort of thing to talk over with your prospective agent.

hope that goes well by the way.


 

Quote: Marc P @ April 1 2008, 3:16 PM BST

I'm not saying I disagree with your sentiment. I do think 'feeling honoured' is perhaps a tad too far. It's about a two way investment, and a fee for an option is basically taking the project off the market. That's what it is there for. Doesn't have to be about money of course, but there is usually a certain amount of development that takes place after an option so it's all tied up with that as well. As the title of your thread suggests, maybe this is the sort of thing to talk over with your prospective agent.

hope that goes well by the way.

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Yeah, consider it on the list of questions.
 

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Quote: Seefacts @ April 1 2008, 1:28 PM BST

But a script is only worth something if a channel is interested.

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Well, not really. At least, not completely. Production companies speculate to accumulate all the time. Ideas are worth money to them. Even those ideas that don't end up getting made will help them build relationships with the channels (i.e. we bring you good ideas, work with good people, etc...).

Also, if they believe in an idea, some production companies will pay a writer a few grand to knock up a pilot script before the idea has even been pitched to a channel. They wouldn't do that if they believed scripts were only worth something once a channel has seen them.

Quote: Seefacts @ April 1 2008, 1:51 PM BST

No that's not how it works at all.

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Yeah it is. Marc's right - it's about mutual commitment. Doesn't matter if you're uncommissioned and unrepresented, if you've got an idea they want to pitch, then they should option it (after all, it covers them too - as it stops the writer giving it to anyone else). As I said above, some companies try to get away without optioning (and a lot of writers - myself included - have let them do so), but that doesn't make it right.

I wouldn't appear so averse to making money in the meeting with your agent, if I were you Good luck with it.
 

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Quote: Bomber @ April 1 2008, 5:28 PM BST

Well, not really. At least, not completely. Production companies speculate to accumulate all the time. Ideas are worth money to them. Even those ideas that don't end up getting made will help them build relationships with the channels (i.e. we bring you good ideas, work with good people, etc...).

Also, if they believe in an idea, some production companies will pay a writer a few grand to knock up a pilot script before the idea has even been pitched to a channel. They wouldn't do that if they believed scripts were only worth something once a channel has seen them.



Yeah it is. Marc's right - it's about mutual commitment. Doesn't matter if you're uncommissioned and unrepresented, if you've got an idea they want to pitch, then they should option it (after all, it covers them too - as it stops the writer giving it to anyone else). As I said above, some companies try to get away without optioning (and a lot of writers - myself included - have let them do so), but that doesn't make it right.

I wouldn't appear so averse to making money in the meeting with your agent, if I were you Good luck with it.

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I don't think any of the biggest production companies in the UK need to strengthen their relationships with the BBC. It's no coincidence a lot of the big hits come from them.

If they get a script that's pitchable but just need a few tweaks, and one that needs more work - what, they'd pay the writer of the poorer script because it needs more doing to it, but not the other because that can go straight to TV Centre?

Companies aren't 'getting away' with anything, really. It's all about the writer making sure they get something else from it - contacts, proper work, an agent.
 

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Quote: Seefacts @ April 1 2008, 6:04 PM BST

I don't think any of the biggest production companies in the UK need to strengthen their relationships with the BBC. It's no coincidence a lot of the big hits come from them.

If they get a script that's pitchable but just need a few tweaks, and one that needs more work - what, they'd pay the writer of the poorer script because it needs more doing to it, but not the other because that can go straight to TV Centre?

Companies aren't 'getting away' with anything, really. It's all about the writer making sure they get something else from it - contacts, proper work, an agent.

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Perhaps the biggest production companies don't have to try quite as hard as the rest, but at what point were we only talking about the biggest? Producers from every production company are trying to cultivate relationships with the channels all the time. That is, after all, a significant part of their job.

I'm not sure I get what your trying to say in your 2nd paragraph. I think you're assuming that we were talking about pitching a poorly formed idea. Again, I think the goalposts of the conversation have shifted a little. If an idea needs work, and is not ready to go to the channels, then of course a production company won't send it - and can't be expected to option it either.

Absolutely - this business is about making contacts, getting work, getting an agent, etc... but we've also got to eat. I made most of my income last year from production company speculation (mostly sitcom options but also companies asking us to create proposals for them to send to the channels), and without companies doing the decent thing and paying for the rights to our intellectual property, I would have starved. Or been forced to eat my writing partner but frankly, he's all skin and bone.
 

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Quote: Bomber @ April 1 2008, 7:07 PM BST

Perhaps the biggest production companies don't have to try quite as hard as the rest, but at what point were we only talking about the biggest? Producers from every production company are trying to cultivate relationships with the channels all the time. That is, after all, a significant part of their job.

I'm not sure I get what your trying to say in your 2nd paragraph. I think you're assuming that we were talking about pitching a poorly formed idea. Again, I think the goalposts of the conversation have shifted a little. If an idea needs work, and is not ready to go to the channels, then of course a production company won't send it - and can't be expected to option it either.

Absolutely - this business is about making contacts, getting work, getting an agent, etc... but we've also got to eat. I made most of my income last year from production company speculation (mostly sitcom options but also companies asking us to create proposals for them to send to the channels), and without companies doing the decent thing and paying for the rights to our intellectual property, I would have starved. Or been forced to eat my writing partner but frankly, he's all skin and bone.

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Re the second paragraph - you said if there's an idea that the company like they'll pay the writer to knock up a script. But if the script is fine - what, they get nothing, and it get gets pitched? Very complicated and pointless to discuss, so we'll move on from that. Even I'm confused . . .

I'd be interested to know how many sitcom scripts were optioned in 2007. I reckon not a lot, things have changed.

 

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Quote: Seefacts @ April 1 2008, 8:13 PM BST

Re the second paragraph - you said if there's an idea that the company like they'll pay the writer to knock up a script. But if the script is fine - what, they get nothing, and it get gets pitched? Very complicated and pointless to discuss, so we'll move on from that. Even I'm confused . . .

I'd be interested to know how many sitcom scripts were optioned in 2007. I reckon not a lot, things have changed.

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Yeah, it would be good to know how many scripts were optioned last year, and how that relates to previous years. I have heard that money had tightened up over the past couple of years, but I know that many scripts are still being optioned.
 

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Sounds an interesting way to make a living from scripts being optioned.

Marc Blake often talks about having 'sold' sitcom episodes. Do you think he was talking about pieces being optioned?
 

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Did you meet the agent yet seefacts, I can't be bothered to read all the pages to see if you did LOL
 

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Quote: bushbaby @ April 2 2008, 9:55 AM BST

Did you meet the agent yet seefacts, I can't be bothered to read all the pages to see if you did LOL

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So lazy . . .

It's tomorrow, I'll report back.
 

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